Survivor Samoa: A Look at the Characters and the Story in Survivor Speculation Forum

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Survivor Samoa: A Look at the Characters and the Story

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panurge46		#121	[-]
Posts: 1587 (12/14/09 06:16 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Of all the things I've lost, I miss my ads the most. Right! Remove this ad Why do the edgic fights have to be carried in here?! My take is that editing always leaves room for interpretation so nothing is definite. No Oo, I never said Natalie's win is obvious. In fact, I once paraphrased Dave and ended a post by saying: "If the season ends up the way I'm expecting it to end up, I will be shocked." Mick could win but, if he does so, it will be with a very poor story unless he overturns Russell. Beating him in votes when it was never his plan makes for a story with holes. Since Edgic is being moved here, I'll copy a post I made there that was ignored: Traditionally, episode #1 has set up the story but, looking back, we know one confessional was completely wrong: Brett: "This lady with the mullet, she's probably a super outdoors woman that will naturally set forth as our leader." Shambutch has been the cause of Galu's demise so she led them the wrong way. We can also say that the next confessional was wrong: Shannon: "Dude, I'm a people magnet. People have gravitated to me my entire life. It's like: "This chick rocks, we love her." Sorry Shambitch, but most players hate you. The next ones applied to Russell and those were useful but we saw that it was better to stick with Russell than oppose him or distrust him. This brings me to: Mick: "I do have leadership qualities. In the operating room, you have to make snap decisions." Where I ask a question: What if episode #1 was done to lead us the wrong way? Mick's first confessional has been constantly proven wrong. Even in the latest episode, we saw Mick unable to act when he considered Russell was a snake. The way his story is going, it seems he would win if and only if he gets rid of Russell. That's his plan. Like Gregg's plan was to get rid of Tom. How succesful was he? Wasn't Gregg a MOR-type of edit?!!!! Mick's numbers are good but his content seems all wrong to me. It looks like Burnett is telling Mick that he may be good in an operating room but that Survivor is a different animal. Men are still shown talking too much: Jaison revealing too much info to Monica and Brett. Mick talking but not acting, Russell always revealing more than he should... Natalie stays quietly on course. It seems like a pattern. BTW Blake: Swan, the player that assumed his leadership, was said to have been in an excellent position to win the game before leaving to something totally outside the game so Monica's confessional was also proven wrong.
chapera rocks		#122	[-]
Posts: 12227 (12/14/09 06:19 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Kitty Pryde1 wrote: The only biased person is you, as we've clearly established. The only reason Mick has so many haters is because not only would him winning fly in the face of Edgic (since he's had no meaningful editing since the first episode, were he HAD to be included as part of a twist), but him winning would mean all the craft paid to Jaison, Russell, Natalie, and even Shambo, wouldn't mean jack shit since the bland, MOR guy who never did anything won by virtue of God-knows-what reasons. Seriously, how the hell can you honestly say that a toneless narrator edit is a winner's edit? When has that EVER been the case? When has a winner's visibility and story actually DECLINED in the episode leading up to the merge and the episodes following the merge. If Mick wins, yeah, he's the majority pick, but Edgic can't even claim credit for a victory, because Mick doesn't fit our guidelines and doesn't fit Edgic trends. Deal with it. There isn't a big red X big enough for this statement. It's no surprise Blake couldn't go very long without devolving into a condescending piece of shit again. Kudos though, the few days you were eloquent and humble were quite enjoyable.
BlakeB717		#123	[-]
Posts: 2614 (12/14/09 06:26 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts	You don't see me posting that in Edgic. I've decided to "outlet" my douchiness to other threads. I couldn't disagree more with a thing Kitty said. I love how we're ignoring the hostility Kitty initially (and unfairly) presented before I raised the bar in aggression. That's alright, though. I'm a big boy.
BlakeB717		#124	[-]
Posts: 2615 (12/14/09 06:27 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Kitty Pryde1 wrote: The only biased person is you, as we've clearly established. The only reason Mick has so many haters is because not only would him winning fly in the face of Edgic (since he's had no meaningful editing since the first episode, were he HAD to be included as part of a twist), but him winning would mean all the craft paid to Jaison, Russell, Natalie, and even Shambo, wouldn't mean jack shit since the bland, MOR guy who never did anything won by virtue of God-knows-what reasons. Seriously, how the hell can you honestly say that a toneless narrator edit is a winner's edit? When has that EVER been the case? When has a winner's visibility and story actually DECLINED in the episode leading up to the merge and the episodes following the merge. If Mick wins, yeah, he's the majority pick, but Edgic can't even claim credit for a victory, because Mick doesn't fit our guidelines and doesn't fit Edgic trends. Deal with it. First post which lept outside debate boundaries. Completely rude reamrks will be given horribly rude responses.
cindidindi76		#125	[-]
Posts: 20928 (12/14/09 06:42 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	It's okay for anyone else to be rude. Just not you. Because you're the worst person EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BlakeB717		#126	[-]
Posts: 2616 (12/14/09 06:51 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts	LOL Well I can't be rude for no reason ;) But Kitty's post basically said I was an idiot, so I wasn't going to let that slide easily =P
Oowatanite		#127	[-]
Posts: 9711 (12/14/09 08:30 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	panurge46 wrote: "If the season ends up the way I'm expecting it to end up, I will be ~~shocked~~ bragging." Fixed. But your bragging will have no basis in themes and edits and storylines. I have acknowledged that Mick's win will be boring and he will also be ignored at the reunion. But he still wins because Russhole loses and someone has to win. It could be Brett, it could be Jaison, it could be Shambo, it could be Natalie. The edit suggests that it is Mick or Jaison.
chapera rocks		#128	[-]
Posts: 12228 (12/14/09 08:33 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	BlakeB717 wrote: Kitty Pryde1 wrote: The only biased person is you, as we've clearly established. The only reason Mick has so many haters is because not only would him winning fly in the face of Edgic (since he's had no meaningful editing since the first episode, were he HAD to be included as part of a twist), but him winning would mean all the craft paid to Jaison, Russell, Natalie, and even Shambo, wouldn't mean jack shit since the bland, MOR guy who never did anything won by virtue of God-knows-what reasons. Seriously, how the hell can you honestly say that a toneless narrator edit is a winner's edit? When has that EVER been the case? When has a winner's visibility and story actually DECLINED in the episode leading up to the merge and the episodes following the merge. If Mick wins, yeah, he's the majority pick, but Edgic can't even claim credit for a victory, because Mick doesn't fit our guidelines and doesn't fit Edgic trends. Deal with it. First post which lept outside debate boundaries. Completely rude reamrks will be given horribly rude responses. Yeah, you're rude sarcasm towards panurge had nothing to do with it right? You weren't mocking him for choosing someone other than Mick, were you? Like you said, dish it out and take it, "big boy". To quote you, take this edgic shit out of this thread because this is about STORY. Nope, no shred of edgic in this thread please.
BlakeB717		#129	[-]
Posts: 2618 (12/14/09 08:37 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Yeah, I was making fun of panurge. I like him, but I do think the "gems" Oo pointed out are quite funny. I would hate to lose this thread, even if its accuracy is low. Just like I love Edgic, he loves the story. He should get to have his fun, too. Sorry, panurge.
Kitty Pryde1		#130	[-]
Posts: 11048 (12/14/09 08:41 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Of all the things I've lost, I miss my ads the most. Right! Remove this ad Mick's biggest problem is story, so it's easy to see why this thread is being dismissed so casually. I mean, if Mick were the winner, it's not just a matter of him being so ignored. It's also a matter of the other three Foa Foas all getting substantial, quality edits. Jaison has consistently had a story since the first episode in which he got the same SPV as Mick (from Mike) and he had a connection to the theme of race. Natalie may have had a shitty edit all season long, but her first episode started off being included in Russell's dumb girl alliance and then SHE was the one Betsy talked to about women's intuition, giving her an early connection to the theme of female domination. Russell, do I even need to say it? He's been shoved down our throats as an amazing player to be respected as a gamer. I get that Mick is probably not the most interesting guy, but neither was Yul. And Yul had FAR more content to his edit than Mick has gotten. Why would they edit their winner as the least deserving member of an underdog tribe? Hell, even if he was a shitty leader, they could've cut some of his negative comments out to make him look positive, given that tha tribe overcame an 8-4 defecit. Why would the editors make Russell S. look like God's gift to Galu and then completely ignore Mick if Mick was the winner. His edit makes NO sense from a story standpoint, or from the logic half of Edgic. All he's got are numbers, numbers that could EASILY be attributed to the fact that as the leader, the producers went to him for those narrative confessionals he's been giving all season. Ironic how the second he lost that necklace, he gets two UTRs and an MOR2 at the merge.
Oowatanite		#131	[-]
Posts: 9712 (12/14/09 08:52 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Kitty Pryde1 wrote: It's also a matter of the other three Foa Foas all getting substantial, quality edits ..... Natalie may have had a shitty edit all season long, but her first episode started off being included in Russell's dumb girl alliance and then SHE was the one Betsy talked to about women's intuition, giving her an early connection to the theme of female domination. OH. MY. GOD. Briefly being called the "dumber blonde girl with the long hair" is a substantial quality edit ? Briefly being shown on camera during Betsy's "women's intuition" comment is a substantial quality edit ? Are you crazy or drunk or high or something ?????
BlakeB717		#132	[-]
Posts: 2620 (12/14/09 09:01 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Yeah, not sure how Natalie's edit (or "story") trumps Mick's... but remember, if it hadn't been for the twist, we know that Mick would have been ignored because we are mind-readers. If you're involved in a twist you can't win, apparently..
chapera rocks		#133	[-]
Posts: 12229 (12/14/09 09:07 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Mick dropped off the face of Samoa after the leader twist concluded only to resurface to build doubt about Russell's dominance. Wouldn't the merge have been a great place to insert Mick's withdrawal from leadership, how relieved he was, etc.? Yep. Did he get that? Nope. Natalie's story trumps Mick's, since she's been involved strategically and storywise. She is that dumbass girl, she did play her role in success for Foa Foa (we've seen the sacrifices Russell and Jaison made as well, but one Foa Foa has yet to do anything for the alliance).
panurge46		#134	[-]
Posts: 1588 (12/14/09 10:06 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Oowatanite wrote: panurge46 wrote: "If the season ends up the way I'm expecting it to end up, I will be ~~shocked~~ bragging." Fixed. But your bragging will have no basis in themes and edits and storylines. You seem to be able to read the future!! No, I don't brag. I may laugh a bit at you but that's because you are SO sure of yourself. Did you read my episode #1 post? There were 3 themes noted: A Producer imposed Theme of leadership 2 Edited Themes: - Honesty vs Lies - Action vs Talk. This is what I wrote about Natalie after that episode: Natalie: For her, being only a deckhand could be even more troubling than it is for the Galu women. She went to TC but still didn't receive a moment to present herself. She's part of RussHell's dumbass girls but at least she was always shown working when he told us about them. They could have shown her sunbathing or swimming in the ocean like the Galu women but, instead, she was always working on palm fronds. Not much, but it's something. On the other hand, she was the one shown when RussHell exposed his plan of misery. Will she be able to handle it? I wrote that last sentence thinking for sure she wouldn't handle it but, looking back, it was noticeable that when Mick and Jaison complained from the rain, Natalie wasn't heard complaining. She did handle it. As far as Honesty VS Lies she beats Russell here for sure and we don't know what will happen with Mick's lie about his own profession. Will that come back to haunt him? Action vs Talk: Talk was presented as being bad and that's all what Jaison and Mick did last week: A lot of talk but no action. Of course, Russell talks and acts more than anyone else so we'll have to see where that goes. For Natalie, it was noted that it was the males who liked to talk but weren't listening to each other. A win by Natalie or Russell would fit the themes very well. It's just that I prefer Natalie's angle and the manipulation we've seen in her edit. Mick, I have to say, has a substantial story. It's just that I feel it's all wrong. He was supposed to make snap decisions, he constantly waffles. He was supposed to let Ben hang himself, he became Ben's protector. In Survivor, refusing leadership has never been good. (Think Ulong) Mick couldn't make fire. (Note that he's learned how since but we haven't been shown him making it) He's constantly shown laying down in the shelter instead of acting. He's riding Russell's coat tails but he's not talking of beating him with the votes. He's practially telling us that Russell will beat him. All wrong. Jaison's story was all about his personal battle. Too many lows, too many put downs by Russell (calling him a whiny baby) too much regret, not enough actions. He's definitely on a journey to prove himself. Last Edited By: panurge46 12/14/09 10:11 PM. Edited 2 times.
AndreSurvivor		#135	[-]
Posts: 648 (12/15/09 12:17 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	BlakeB717 wrote: Yeah, not sure how Natalie's edit (or "story") trumps Mick's... but remember, if it hadn't been for the twist, we know that Mick would have been ignored because we are mind-readers. If you're involved in a twist you can't win, apparently.. I remember when Sierra got attention in the first episode due to the twist, and as soon as her UTR/UTR merge episodes came, she was immediately (and correctly) discounted. Mick is a terrible leader, hardly ever strategizes, and fails at taking out the snake that is Russell. Mick is going to keep playing with the snake and get bitten, with a jury that will see Russell as an arrogant jerk and Mick as the spineless fool who couldn't make a move. Natalie will be the one who was nice, made necessary moves and stayed "out of the way." She killed food. She kicked butt at winning and appreciated a reward (with a strange voice-over commenary -- was it done after the show wrapped filming?). Episode 4 game commentary -- playing Russell, saying he will be hated and she could be the likeable option. I could be totally wrong. But it makes sense.
craig		#136	[-]
Posts: 16665 (12/16/09 12:31 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	To me Natalie and Mick are summed up like this: Mick: Lots of Screentime, Little Substance Natalie: Little Screentime, Lots of Substance. That's essential right - Natalie has more story and substance than Mick. Lots may be an overstatement, but so what? There more to making and impact on viewers - real visibility - than number of confessionals or number of sentences they let somebody natter.
kenc333		#137	[-]
Posts: 9986 (12/16/09 01:15 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	I still think it's all about Russell's "I'm gonna show everyone how easy it is to win this game" quote. So Russell ends up doing all this strategic work, and Natalie, who's receiving a less-than-substantial edit appears to not be struggling and easily wins the game. "You've got it made, I'm telling you"
Lexxan		#138	[-]
Posts: 785 (12/17/09 08:56 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Each Survivor Season has a storyline about how the winner got their Million Dollars. We know Russell doesn't win, but he's obviously the narrator of the season (similar to Sugar in Gabon). In other words, Russell plays an extremely vital part in the story, which ultimately leads to Mick or Natalie winning. Looking at the story up till this point, Mick does not play a part at all in Survivor: Samoa's story. Natalie does. Therefor, Natalie wins.
rioothello		#139	[-]
Posts: 80 (12/17/09 02:50 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	chapera rocks wrote: Mick dropped off the face of Samoa after the leader twist concluded only to resurface to build doubt about Russell's dominance. Wouldn't the merge have been a great place to insert Mick's withdrawal from leadership, how relieved he was, etc.? Yep. Did he get that? Nope. Natalie's story trumps Mick's, since she's been involved strategically and storywise. She is that dumbass girl, she did play her role in success for Foa Foa (we've seen the sacrifices Russell and Jaison made as well, but one Foa Foa has yet to do anything for the alliance). But remember, we have never had a 12 person merge before so Mick is excused for his absence. Besides, he got a confessional before the merge feast because Bob and JT did too, even though Bob's was fake but it still counts because I said so. What Blake would have said.
chapera rocks		#140	[-]
Posts: 12269 (12/17/09 03:47 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Of all the things I've lost, I miss my ads the most. Right! Remove this ad If Blake's not being antagonizing atm, why would you try to provoke trouble?

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Survivor Samoa: A Look at the Characters and the Story