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burberrylad |
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Natalie played a better game than Russell in the context of Samoa <3, just like Amber played a better game than Boston Rob in All Stars <3
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Shred |
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Russell is also a terrible loser. He goes around now calling Natalie a bitch in interviews. Totally uncalled for. Face it the man is sexist and is mad a woman
beat him.
Look at the way he treated Marisa Betsy Dumb ass girl alliance Look at the way he called Monica a bitch for just stating the truth Remember in that episode where Monica spilled the beans about his money? He went over to Natalie and began to yell at her, why? Cause she was a woman. When he found out it was Jaison he did nothing about it but have a normal conversation. Seriously. |
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burberrylad |
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Because Russell is gross. I hope he does an Amanda next season and gets to the Final 3 and lose again <3 To another womn hopefully <3
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Wc3Fanatic |
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Eliza, how can you not at least be able to see how Nataile played a great game? Name a single mistake she made. You can
say she only got there because Russel "chose her", but can't you see how Natalie manipulated him to choose her, and how she was clearly the
benefactor of that partnership? As early as episode four she identified him as the goat on-camera. According to her, she stroked his ego every day -- and is
that really that hard to believe -- in order to make him underestimate her. The only time Natalie NEEDED to do something -- flip a Galu -- she did, getting rid
of Erik and sealing Shambo as a FF in one move, changing the game from 8-4 to 6-5. Russel didn't flip Shambo, Shambo was still purple at that point. Shambo
voted for Jaison, she expressed multiple times that purple was broken when Erik was voted out. Natalie made THE MOVE of the season.
I'm sure you're impressed about how Russel was able to control pre-merge FF, but both Jaison and Natalie both expressed desire to keep him around as a shield/F2 goat. He's a strong man, he can't be voted out due to challenge prowess. Natalie, on the other hand, was able to survive pre-merge as a weak woman by understanding how to survive -- pretend you're stupid and stroke Russel's ego. If you watch Natalie's post-show interviews, or read her bio, it's clear she knew what she was doing, she didn't just stumble her way there. And even if you think that Russel played a better strategic game, which I will vehemently argue he did not -- it doesn't matter how many yard syou can drive down the field, if you can't score a touchdown you're not my pick for quarterback -- he was completely unaware of the social game. He's Dreamz 2.0, except better at finding idols and more self-congratulatory. He had 18 seasons to watch the game and understand how juries tend to work. He could've observed his ousted opponents and tried to figure out how they'd vote -- Natalie, in post show interviews, talked about how she did that whereas Russel is still pulling the loser's mantra of "no regrets". Russel made huge mistakes in being unnecessarily arrogant, spitting on his opponents when they were out. That's NOT good gameplay. That's not acceptable under the explanation of "it's just a game, i'm just a character" -- it's just bad decision making, of which Natalie made none. The grand manipulator of the season was CBS, shoving Russel down our throats as "the biggest villain ever" and "the best player ever" in order to boost their ratings. |
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JerseyJerk |
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Posts: 4502 (12/22/09 01:38 PM) Registered user |
Lets just say Russell comes on some type of All Star season in the future and makes it to the end again and looses....will you all then admit he sucks??
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Oowatanite |
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JerseyJerk wrote:Well, he would become the male Amanda. |
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Oowatanite |
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Wc3Fanatic wrote: Agreed. |
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xoDC3xo |
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Ichiro20 wrote:She saw that the strong women were being voted out. She adapted and formed a relationship with the one in control. He blindly thought she wasn't going to be respected in the final 3 and actively protected her and brought her to the final three. She knew this and gladly accepted to be his ally and knew his blind arrogance would never allow him to see her as a threat. She never had a single drop of blood on her hands from any members of the jury because of the huge meat shield she had in the name of Russell. She got along with all the Galu's and had a great bond with Brett and Laura. Ashley could have easily played the same strategy as her, but Natalie intelligently took the role and stroked his ego. Liz, Marisa, and Betsy all could have done the same thing. They didn't. None of them made it to the jury and won. Was her game hardest to execute? No. But it didn't need to be. Honestly what do people propose Natalie should have done to be more deserving. Make lots of unnecessary moves? She didn't need to she had Russell. |
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AmightyRo |
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Eliza kissing Russell's arse so she can have the possibility of teaming up with him on S28 :-o
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NickF227 |
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burberrylad wrote: I love the controversy I'm causing with my comments about the outcome of #Survivor Samoa!! I've been called some BAD things. Chill out ppl! A.L.O.L. If you can't take the heat don't be a bitch and misogynist supporter. <3 |
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PJMichaelangelo |
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NickF227 wrote:Doesn't you calling her a bitch make you a misogynist yourself? |
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LaLa |
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LOL @ Eliza causing so much controversy and stirring sh** up and loving it. <3
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xoDC3xo |
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This might be a stupid question Eliza but I'd like to pose it anyway. Bit of a hypothetical far-fetched question but here goes.
If you weren't cast for Vanuatu and got cast in Natalie's spot in Samoa, knowing how you know how the whole season went down, would you have chosen to play Natalie's game? I suspect even knowing how the result came out, you would refuse to play her game. That is what I was coming with at the "I'm not surprised you lost twice" comment. I find it absolutely hilarious that in a game where a lot of people respect lying, and manipulation "looking like you're undeserving" is something people worry about. You could counter that you know Russell and saw who he was on the show and would make counter alliances with Liz, Betsy, Marisa etc. But that is the mistake you're making. You'd be willing on playing it your way and "look good" than be the best player and win a million dollars knowing how it all went down? Hopefully I'm making sense. I don't know how you would answer. But I'm just going based on what I think you'd say. Feel free to disagree with how you think you would act LOL. I haven't see you respond to anyone's arguments about Natalie being deserving, and hopefully you haven't taken my posts as attack. I've just been surprised at your responses. You don't have to respond, but I'd be interested in your opinion here. |
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GeneOkerlund27 |
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EVERYBODY CALM DOWN SO WE CAN GET TO REALLY IMPORTANT THINGS
ELIZA, DID YOU PURCHASE ANY BUFFS FROM CBS DOT COM PRIOR TO SURVIVOR: VANUATU AND IF SO WHICH ONES?!?! |
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Oowatanite |
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LaLa wrote: |
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Teighteen |
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GeneOkerlund27 wrote:Agreed. When is Brett coming to visit us? |
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Venatrix Avia |
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xoDC3xo wrote:I have no idea how Eliza would answer that question, but I know how I would. I couldn't, dude. Not for a million dollars could I play the dumb little woman on National TV and snuggle up with a misogynist for 39 days. I just couldn't. I'd be more of a Jaison type: "Either this fucker goes, or I go. Even if I have to quit." This is just one of the many, many reasons that I would suck at this game. |
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xoDC3xo |
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Venatrix Avia wrote:Fair answer, but you admit that you might not do very well at the game. There are certain things you wouldn't do to win. You'd be a Marisa. Fine, I respected Marisa that she didn't want to play to Russell, but she was voted out first. She didn't play the game she needed to. Honestly, I have no qualms with people having problems sucking up to Russell. Just don't claim Natalie wasn't smart in doing what she did for this season, Marisa didn't do what Natalie did and was voted out first for it. Is Marisa a bad person? No. Is Natalie a bad person? No. Did Marisa play a bad game? For this season, for sure. Did Natalie play a bad game? No, she played great. Does Marisa have a million dollars? No. Does Natalie have a million dollars? Yes. Just my two cents. |
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Venatrix Avia |
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Oh, sure, I'm not disputing that at all. I think Natalie played a solid game. She played Russell like a fiddle. Good for her. If anything, I'm
more impressed by her game because it's something that I know I'd never have been able to do.
But I don't know if that's why Eliza lacks respect for Natalie's game. I get the impression it's more a combination of a preference for flashy play (Eliza did show a certain...fondness for big splashy moves on her season) and the fact that Natalie just isn't the sort of person she warms to very much. And I guess I don't see much point in disputing stylistic or personality preferences. Fans are often reluctant to credit the gameplay of people they just don't care for, or styles of gameplay that they just for whatever reason don't like (I, for example, have a really hard time reacting positively to immunity hog wins, even though that's obviously a big part of the game. It's just an emotional preference.), and Eliza isn't obligated to take a thoroughly objective approach. She's a fan, and like other fans, she gets emotionally invested in the characters and reacts with sometimes violent emotion to the events of the season. In a couple of years, I suspect that she'll feel differently about the season. It's always easier to talk about a season dispassionately once time has mellowed some of those strong emotions. Remember how people felt right after the end of Season 6? This too shall pass. In the meantime, I don't see much point in trying to hector someone into recognizing the value of gameplay that they just didn't like, especially when doing so involves so much finger-pointing about their own flaws as a player of seasons past. (Not to mention comments about their political activities!) It's argument ad hominem, which I always find frustrating, and which I find particularly so in this situation, since no one else on this thread has a public performance as a Survivor player which can be similarly cited and criticized as a part of the debate. Some of the posts here have seemed awfully, I dunno, personal to me, and I've found it a little uncomfortable to read. edited to add: You know what, I just realized that this seems like it was directed at you, when you've actually been perfectly respectful. I'm sorry about that. It was more a vocalization of frustration with the tenor of the thread as a whole than something directly relevant to your question (which I answered in part because I thought it was such an interesting one.
Last Edited By: Venatrix Avia
12/22/09 05:54 PM.
Edited 1 times.
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xoDC3xo |
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Venatrix Avia wrote:Well Eliza is a strong individual. She has feisty personality. She's a lawyer and she's played the game twice. It's more than I can say for myself. She posts at sucks, I think she can handle a little criticism. I can only speak for myself but I don't feel like any of my posts have been disparaging towards Eliza. She thinks Russ deserved to win. I don't think that is true at all. I have never questioned Eliza's character. I'm sure she's a nice person and everything but she has yet to dispute any of my claims. Maybe she just doesn't want to. That's fine. I still feel the need to defend Natalie. I have a preference for certain players as well. There is a difference between entertainment and good game play. I thought Shii Ann was entertaining. Did she play the best game? Probably not. I found Brian winning to be dry, but there is no question he deserved to win. That one prob isn't a very good example. Here's a better one. I really was hoping and rooting for Stephanie to win Guatemala. I thought her story was fascinating and she dominated. I knew she had no chance but I recognized that. She doesn't have to see things the way I do but nothing wrong with some dissent and some discussion and pointing out flawed thinking, or what I personally feel is flawed thinking. ETA: No problem, understood. ;)
Last Edited By: xoDC3xo
12/22/09 06:17 PM.
Edited 1 times.
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