Buffy Month(s). in Clubs that Suck. No, Really. Forum

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Buffy Month(s).

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myopics		#341	[-]
Posts: 921 (01/09/10 10:11 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	If at first you don't succeed; call it version 1.0 Remove this ad Oaf wrote: I think they hooked up next season not because Spike was suddenly everything Buffy wanted in a man, but because of her self-destructive phase. You could argue that there was a big leap between "Crush" and "Intervention", in which Spike is acknowledged by Buffy for his nobility, but they did have their trust-related ups and downs later in the series, with the attempted rape in "Seeing Red" as the prime example. Only in season 7, when Spike has his soul back and everyone's wary of him, that Buffy takes a stand and announces that she trusts him completely. Yeah, season 6 Spuffy was never meant to be "right". Everything about the way it was portrayed showed that it was an extremely destructive relationship. Though it provided a lot of material for the final 2 seasons, I really didn't see the point of Spike falling in love with Buffy though. It served no symbolic or developmental purpose. Oaf wrote: I forgot to mention that I hated the yellow crayon spoof at the beginning. Initially, it was one of the most genuinely nice moments on the show, and they totally threw it in the trash for a gag, and not a particularly good one at that. Hmm... the yellow crayon gag wasn't THAT funny, but I don't feel that it took away anything from its significance to Willow and Xander. ncassaro wrote: Normal Again ranks very high for me as well. Very very fascinating concept for an episode, and such a mindfuck. And I love the way the ending leaves things open for the viewer to interpret. I actually read a really interesting article a couple of years ago, I think it was on alt.tv.buffy-v-slayer where I used to troll back in high school lol. The guy made a good point about how Tara, the outsider in Buffy's life, is the one who unties everyone and this was possibly "proof" that Buffy was in fact insane. I never notice things like that lol. Selfless ranks high for me as well, but I wouldn't put it in the top 10. Emma Caulfield is really really underused in season 7. It's kind of ridiculous that she got star billing that season when she was barely in it. But she really shines in Selfless. Plus Selfless just kinda had a retro feel to it that made it seem like an episode from the early seasons IMO which was very welcome in season 7. Normal Again <3! The point you mentioned about Tara sounds very interesting. Can you explain it more? I don't get how Tara being the one to to free Willow, Xan and Dawn showed that the slayerverse wasn't real. Selfless <3 too! Haha. Drew Goddard really took 6 years of repressed fanboyism and let it flow into the script with an explosion of brillance. From the exposition to the character establishment to the mood, everything was very distinctively "Buffy".
ncassaro		#342	[-]
Posts: 1797 (01/09/10 10:22 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	myopics wrote: Oaf wrote: I think they hooked up next season not because Spike was suddenly everything Buffy wanted in a man, but because of her self-destructive phase. You could argue that there was a big leap between "Crush" and "Intervention", in which Spike is acknowledged by Buffy for his nobility, but they did have their trust-related ups and downs later in the series, with the attempted rape in "Seeing Red" as the prime example. Only in season 7, when Spike has his soul back and everyone's wary of him, that Buffy takes a stand and announces that she trusts him completely. Yeah, season 6 Spuffy was never meant to be "right". Everything about the way it was portrayed showed that it was an extremely destructive relationship. Though it provided a lot of material for the final 2 seasons, I really didn't see the point of Spike falling in love with Buffy though. It served no symbolic or developmental purpose. Oaf wrote: I forgot to mention that I hated the yellow crayon spoof at the beginning. Initially, it was one of the most genuinely nice moments on the show, and they totally threw it in the trash for a gag, and not a particularly good one at that. Hmm... the yellow crayon gag wasn't THAT funny, but I don't feel that it took away anything from its significance to Willow and Xander. ncassaro wrote: Normal Again ranks very high for me as well. Very very fascinating concept for an episode, and such a mindfuck. And I love the way the ending leaves things open for the viewer to interpret. I actually read a really interesting article a couple of years ago, I think it was on alt.tv.buffy-v-slayer where I used to troll back in high school lol. The guy made a good point about how Tara, the outsider in Buffy's life, is the one who unties everyone and this was possibly "proof" that Buffy was in fact insane. I never notice things like that lol. Selfless ranks high for me as well, but I wouldn't put it in the top 10. Emma Caulfield is really really underused in season 7. It's kind of ridiculous that she got star billing that season when she was barely in it. But she really shines in Selfless. Plus Selfless just kinda had a retro feel to it that made it seem like an episode from the early seasons IMO which was very welcome in season 7. Normal Again <3! The point you mentioned about Tara sounds very interesting. Can you explain it more? I don't get how Tara being the one to to free Willow, Xan and Dawn showed that the slayerverse wasn't real. Selfless <3 too! Haha. Drew Goddard really took 6 years of repressed fanboyism and let it flow into the script with an explosion of brillance. From the exposition to the character establishment to the mood, everything was very distinctively "Buffy". I found the post about Normal Again: http://groups.google.com/...yer/msg/dd420ca561516efd Ignore any of my inane posts if you find them haha, it was 2002 so I was in 9th grade and much more n00bish than I am now. And Drew Goddard was great. If only they'd found him sooner!
myopics		#343	[-]
Posts: 922 (01/09/10 11:15 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Sorry, I don't know what everyone else thinks of that, but I don't agree with it at all. I appreciate the thought the guy put into it, but I do not think that is what the writers were going for at all. First off, wasn't the whole Buffy choosing life as a slayer thing resolved within Normal Again itself? She protected her friends against the demon and requested the antidote. Why does the article make it seem as if she is still grappling with going back to that alternate universe for the rest of the series? Even if Buffy still had lingering issues regarding dealing with slayer life, they are completely resolved by Grave. Sure, she had other issues in season 7, but they had nothing to do with her season 6 arc. Secondly, I don't see why Tara would be emblematic of Sunnydale's "normal" community at all. I agree with the part about Tara being symbolic of Buffy's "imaginary" friends (Willow) establishing connections themselves, but that's as far as that arguement can go. Tara is a witch and a scooby, she is tied more to the roles Willow and Xander play. It just so happens that she was especially on the fringe during that period as her and Willow had split up. Couldn't Anya be considered an "outsider" too if you want to use that line of logic? If anyone would be the face of "normal" Sunnydale to Buffy, I would say that it's Dawn. I mentioned before that Dawn was used many times in the series to be the face of the innocence the gang is fighting for. She is annoying, flawed, but in the end good-hearted; just like humanity itself. Plus, it was explicitly mentioned in the episode itself that Buffy created Dawn specially to feed her ties to the slayer world. If the idea that a character could keep Buffy tied to the slayer world because he/she represented Sunnydale community were true (which I personally don't even believe so), that character would be Dawn, not Tara. I also don't see why Buffy would need to have Warren kill Tara. The author claims that Buffy is trying to sever her ties to this world so Tara or whatever she represents cannot prevent Buffy from going back to her "normal" life again. I don't see any of such intentions from the show's writers whatsoever. Buffy never once followed up on increasingly distancing herself from her slayer world after Tara's death. In fact, she is in full force rebutting dark Willow when she tries to convince Buffy that the world just isn't worth it anymore. Even before Buffy's breakout moment in Grave, she can be seen to be once again confident in her role as the slayer when she tells Dark Willow to be prepared to see "what the slayer really is" before they face-off. I don't see how season 7 relates to this at all either. It had completely different themes of leadership and redemption. Buffy never expresses excessive doubt in herself again in season 7, not even after everyone turns on her and she is kicked out of her own house. If anyone wants to take this concept of alternate universes from Normal Again and apply it to the rest of the series, I think that they should focus on finding elements of a utopian/dystopian world in other episodes rather than focusing on Tara's role in all of this. The latter route seems to lead to a dead end.
Oaf		#344	[-]
Posts: 235 (01/10/10 04:47 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	myopics wrote: Holy fuck, I actually did it! I know its mainly for fun, but just out of curiousity, how are we scored? Do we have to get specific placements correct or is it more of a general pattern thing? The latter is very subjective and hard to judge, while the former would technically award points to someone who happened to get a small handful of episodes in the exact right spots, allowing them to make huge mistakes like placing the topmost episode dead last without penalty. Haha, oh well... its gonna be fun seeing people guess any-who (I can't be the only one lame enough to do it right?). About the score - assuming someone else joins in the fun - basically, if you ranked "When She Was Bad" in the 19th spot, and it turned out to end up in the 16th on my list, you would lose 3 points. Likewise, if you put it 3 places too high, you also lose 3 points. That way, if you make a minor mistake, you'll get a minor "fee", and if you rank an episode on an opposite side of the list, you'll lose up to 138 points for one mistake. The person to lose the least amount of points, wins. And I can secretly reveal that right now, you're in the lead... :)
Paparazzi		#345	[-]
Posts: 39 (01/11/10 02:27 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	myopics wrote: Sorry, I don't know what everyone else thinks of that, but I don't agree with it at all. I appreciate the thought the guy put into it, but I do not think that is what the writers were going for at all. First off, wasn't the whole Buffy choosing life as a slayer thing resolved within Normal Again itself? She protected her friends against the demon and requested the antidote. Why does the article make it seem as if she is still grappling with going back to that alternate universe for the rest of the series? Even if Buffy still had lingering issues regarding dealing with slayer life, they are completely resolved by Grave. Sure, she had other issues in season 7, but they had nothing to do with her season 6 arc. Secondly, I don't see why Tara would be emblematic of Sunnydale's "normal" community at all. I agree with the part about Tara being symbolic of Buffy's "imaginary" friends (Willow) establishing connections themselves, but that's as far as that arguement can go. Tara is a witch and a scooby, she is tied more to the roles Willow and Xander play. It just so happens that she was especially on the fringe during that period as her and Willow had split up. Couldn't Anya be considered an "outsider" too if you want to use that line of logic? If anyone would be the face of "normal" Sunnydale to Buffy, I would say that it's Dawn. I mentioned before that Dawn was used many times in the series to be the face of the innocence the gang is fighting for. She is annoying, flawed, but in the end good-hearted; just like humanity itself. Plus, it was explicitly mentioned in the episode itself that Buffy created Dawn specially to feed her ties to the slayer world. If the idea that a character could keep Buffy tied to the slayer world because he/she represented Sunnydale community were true (which I personally don't even believe so), that character would be Dawn, not Tara. I also don't see why Buffy would need to have Warren kill Tara. The author claims that Buffy is trying to sever her ties to this world so Tara or whatever she represents cannot prevent Buffy from going back to her "normal" life again. I don't see any of such intentions from the show's writers whatsoever. Buffy never once followed up on increasingly distancing herself from her slayer world after Tara's death. In fact, she is in full force rebutting dark Willow when she tries to convince Buffy that the world just isn't worth it anymore. Even before Buffy's breakout moment in Grave, she can be seen to be once again confident in her role as the slayer when she tells Dark Willow to be prepared to see "what the slayer really is" before they face-off. I don't see how season 7 relates to this at all either. It had completely different themes of leadership and redemption. Buffy never expresses excessive doubt in herself again in season 7, not even after everyone turns on her and she is kicked out of her own house. If anyone wants to take this concept of alternate universes from Normal Again and apply it to the rest of the series, I think that they should focus on finding elements of a utopian/dystopian world in other episodes rather than focusing on Tara's role in all of this. The latter route seems to lead to a dead end. I agree with everything you just said. That article didn't really make a lot sense. Last Edited By: Paparazzi 01/14/10 06:28 AM. Edited 1 times.
myopics		#346	[-]
Posts: 924 (01/16/10 11:39 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	BUMP! =) Good to know someone thinks so too Paparazzi! Why'd you edit your post? I could have sworn you posted some stuff about season 3 before. I wanted to address it but, alas, it's gone. Haha.
Rafting Persona Queen		#347	[-]
Posts: 12 (01/21/10 03:02 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	RIDDLE: What episode is my avatar from from?
oh ehm gee		#348	[-]
Posts: 4395 (01/21/10 03:50 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Homecoming, no?
Rafting Persona Queen		#349	[-]
Posts: 13 (01/21/10 03:51 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	ya gj!
Oaf		#350	[-]
Posts: 236 (01/25/10 04:32 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	If at first you don't succeed; call it version 1.0 Remove this ad myopics wrote: Well, in making my list, I tried to find a compromise between my own opinion and what I think your preferences are. The general pattern is in line with my opinion; but I had to carry some episodes I didn't really connect with much higher than I would have placed them because I know they strongly appeal to some people, I similarly bumped down some episodes I absolutely adore a few spots because I know that a large part of my liking them is due to my own particular taste. Here's the list: 44 Least Favourites (from least bad to worst ever) 44) 719 Empty Places 43) 502 Real Me 42) 107 Angel 41) 211 Ted 40) 721 End of Days 39) 504 Out of My Mind 38) 412 A New Man 37) 618 Entropy 36) 201 When She Was Bad 35) 302 Dead Man's Party 34) 320 The Prom 33) 609 Smashed 32) 702 Beneath You 31) 708 Sleeper 30) 411 Doomed 29) 306 Band Candy 28) 511 Triangle 27) 409 Something Blue 26) 710 Bring On the Night 25) 402 Living Conditions 24) 111 Out of Mind, Out of Sight 23) 509 Listening to Fear 22) 606 All the Way 21) 208 The Dark Age 20) 407 The Initiative 19) 212 Bad Eggs 18) 706 Him 17) 512 Checkpoint 16) 709 Never Leave Me 15) 108 I Robot… You Jane 14) 104 Teacher's Pet 13) 414 Goodbye Iowa 12) 604 Flooded 11) 612 Doublemeat Palace The Top 10 of Suck 10) 418 Where the Wild Things Are 09) 611 Gone 08) 508 Shadow 07) 106 The Pack 06) 714 First Date 05) 202 Some Assembly Required 04) 220 Go Fish 03) 205 Reptile Boy 02) 204 Inca Mummy Girl 01) 405 Beer Bad Notes: - The Prom (34^th worst), Something Blue (28^th worst) and Checkpoint (17^th worst) were three episodes I know most fans loved, loved and liked respectively. I personally am not particularly fond of any of them. I just couldn't bring myself to bump other episodes off the top 44 list or higher spots in the bottom list to make room for them. - Stuff like Doublemeat Palace (11^th worst), I personally didn't mind that much. I ranked it that low because I knew it had absolutely no shot on anyone else's list. Still higher than all the obvious stinkers though. Obviously I can't reveal too much (because the competition is so stiff) but here are some interesting observations about your bottom 44 ranking: You're right on the money (!) with at least one episode, from season 2. You've ranked one season 5 episode 98 places lower (!) than in my list. 6 out of your bottom 10 are correct! 8 episodes from your bottom 44 are in my top 44. 2 out of my 3 least favorite Buffy episodes of all time aren't even in your bottom 10.
myopics		#351	[-]
Posts: 925 (01/25/10 05:54 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Heya, how have you been? I miss this thread. =( The season 5 episode I ranked 98 (Eek =S) places lower has to be Checkpoint, unless Real Me is your 4th favourite episode of all time. Haha. I really look forward to getting in on the discussion once Checkpoint does show up on the list, I didn't like it at all. You know what, for a lot of the episodes, I just went on impressions that were months old... since I obviously did not watched every episode over. I don't think I was fair to Shadow, it was nowhere as bad at its bottom placement would suggest. I don't have a strong impression of much of season 1 (besides the premiere and finale) because I only saw the rest of the episodes once, like over 10 years ago. So I would probably be most off with them. If the other 2 of your bottom 3 aren't from season 1 though... I would guess Doublemeat Palace and Him.
Oaf		#352	[-]
Posts: 237 (01/26/10 12:25 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	myopics wrote: 44 Favourites (From least good to best ever) 44) 713 The Killer in Me 43) 318 Earshot 42) 505 No Place like Home 41) 716 Storyteller 40) 701 Lessons 39) 605 Life Serial 38) 312 Helpless 37) 103 The Witch 36) 419 New Moon Rising 35) 216 Bewitched, Bothered and Bewildered 34) 207 Lie To Me 33) 506 Family 32) 311 Gingerbread 31) 305 Homecoming 30) 707 Conversations With Dead People 29) 206 Halloween 28) 308 Lover's Walk 27) 310 Amends 26) 415 This Year's Girl 25) 301 Anne 24) 616 Hell's Bells 23) 213 Surprise 22) 608 Tabula Rasa 21) 622 Grave 20) 316 Dopplegangland 19) 410 Hush 18) 313 The Zeppo 17) 613 Dead Things 16) 321-322 Graduation Day 15) 217 Passion 14) 416 Who Are You? 13) 214 Innocence 12) 219 I Only Have Eyes for You 11) 221-222 Becoming The Top 10 of Win 10) 617 Normal Again 09) 309 The Wish 08) 722 Chosen 07) 112 Prophecy Girl 06) 507 Fool for Love 05) 705 Selfless 04) 422 Restless 03) 522 The Gift 02) 516 The Body 01) 607 Once More, With Feeling Notes: - Remember I mentioned that I first narrowed the episodes down to 25 bottom, 40 top and 23 undecided? Well, Lessons, Life Serial, Helpless and The Witch (ranked 37^th to 40^th) were the only 4 from my 23 undecided to make it to the top bunch. Once they were there, I realised that I actually thought they were strongly than some of the episodes I had already marked 'top' so they moved up a few spots. - Conversations With Dead People (ranked 30^th), Lover's Walk (ranked 28^th) and Hush (ranked 19^th) were all episodes I thought were good to great but fans often overrated as much more. I bumped them as far down as I thought I could without it becoming a total sacrilege to the BTVS fanbase. - Dead Things (ranked 17^th), Normal Again (ranked 10^th) and Selfless (ranked 5^th) are all episodes that don't get much hype. I bumped them up as far as I could, once again till the limits of outraging the fanbase, because I personally enjoyed them immensely. - The top 10 is something I fully agree with. Though I wish there were a way for The Zeppo (ranked 18^th) and I Only Have Eyes For You (ranked 12^th) to squeeze in somehow without displacing any of the episodes that are already there. - The Gift (ranked 3^rd) is actually by far my favourite episode! I ranked it 3^rd because I just didn't think anyone else would have enjoyed it more than the two titans I placed above it. Once again, six out of your top 10 are correct. There's an episode that you've ranked 71 spots higher than I did, and another that's 85 (!) higher. Things might change, but for now, you've got one of your top 10 exactly in the correct spot. On the other hand, there's an episode in your top 10 that isn't even in my top 30 (again, for now - I maintain the freedom to change things as I go along). Anyway, myopics, thanks for going through all this trouble, it was really interesting and eye-opening to compare someone else's list to mine. I can't talk about the specific conclusions I've come up with, of course, but I'll probably talk about it when this ranking is all said and done. Doesn't anyone else want to join the fun?
Paparazzi		#353	[-]
Posts: 84 (01/26/10 11:21 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	myopics wrote: BUMP! =) Good to know someone thinks so too Paparazzi! Why'd you edit your post? I could have sworn you posted some stuff about season 3 before. I wanted to address it but, alas, it's gone. Haha. I editted it because I wanted to change what I said. It was pretty much me saying I hated the season (so far) and I thought bringing Angel back and the Willow/Xander thing were terrible plot twists. I'll attempt to make a list, also. But I watched the show years ago when I was like 12, and have only just started re-watching it, so my opinions are probably way off.
Paparazzi		#354	[-]
Posts: 85 (01/26/10 11:55 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	I thought this was gonna be hard, but this is REALLY hard So many of these episodes I am meh or mixed about, but I have to place them high or low... Also I'm having a lot of trouble remembering the difference between episodes like Sleeper, Never Leave Me and Bring On The Night. That entire season just kind of bleeds together for me.
Paparazzi		#355	[-]
Posts: 86 (01/27/10 01:03 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Okay, I've done it! I'm still not totally happy with it, but I don't know what to change. It's really hard to think about what other people may like in an episode, rather than what I personally think of it. 144.) 405 Beer Bad 143.) 215 Bad Eggs 142.) 604 Flooded 141.) 418 Where the Wild Things are 140.) 612 Doublemeat Palace 139.) 204 Inca Mummy Girl 138.) 302 Dead Man's Party 137.) 202 Some Assembly Required 136.) 205 Reptile Boy 135.) 220 Go Fish 134.) 208 The Dark Age 133.) 611 Gone 132.) 714 First Date 131.) 508 Shadow 130.) 701 Lessons 129.) 305 Homecoming (I think this is one some might put in the top half, but I really didn't like it) 128.) 108 I Robot... You Jane 127.) 104 Teacher's Pet 126.) 719 Empty Places 125.) 702 Beneath You (I feel I may have been too harsh on this one, I don't know) 124.) 509 Listening to Fear 123.) 306 Band Candy 122.) 402 Living Conditions 121.) 412 A New Man 120.) 606 All the Way 119.) 708 Sleeper 118.) 201 When She Was Bad 117.) 310 Amends 116.) 414 Goodbye Iowa 115.) 721 End of Days 114.) 709 Never Leave Me 113.) 706 Him (This is one I actually quite liked, but I guess most people didn't) 112.) 106 The Pack 111.) 103 The Witch 110.) 411 Doomed 109.) 710 Bring on the Night 108.) 407 The Initiative 107.) 504 Out of My Mind 106.) 409 Something Blue 105.) 616 Hell's Bells 104.) 609 Smashed 103.) 211 Ted 102.) 311 Gingerbread 101.) 320 The Prom 44.) 502 Real Me 43.) 107 Angel 42.) 605 Life Serial 41.) 308 Lover's Walk (I had 48 in the bottom half, and 40 in the top half, these are the four I moved up) 40.) 505 No Place Like Home 39.) 206 Halloween 38.) 419 New Moon Risisng 37.) 213 Surprise (I really didn't like this episode, but I think most other people probably did) 36.) 618 Entropy (I had trouble with this one, it is probably too high) 35.) 506 Family 34.) 318 Earshot 33.) 216 Bewitched, Bothered and Bewildered 32.) 316 Doppelgangland 31.) 511 Triangle 30.) 716 Storyteller 29.) 207 Lie to Me 28.) 321-322 Graduation 27.) 301 Anne 26.) 312 Helpless 25.) 507 Fool for Love 24.) 512 Checkpoint 23.) 214 Innocense 22.) 613 Dead Things 21.) 415 This Year's Girl 20.) 309 The Wish (I know this is a fan fave, but for me it didn't really have any strong significance to the series, other than proving that Sunnydale needs Buffy) 19.) 608 Tabula Rasa 18.) 313 The Zeppo 17.) 622 Grave 16.) 111 Out of Mind, Out of Sight 15.) 713 The Killer in Me 14.) 219 I Only Have Eyes for You 13.) 617 Normal Again 12.) 410 Hush 11.) 221-222 Becoming 10.) 112 Prophecy Girl 9.) 217 Passion 8.) 705 Selfless 7.) 722 Chosen 6.) 416 Who Are You? 5.) 522 The Gift 4.) 707 Conversations with Dead People 3.) 422 Restless 2.) 607 Once More, With Feeling 1.) 516 The Body
Oaf		#356	[-]
Posts: 239 (01/27/10 03:32 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	AbsurdSchism wrote: Crush was really a turning point for me as a buffy fan. I knew Spike was obsessed but I thought he was going to remain a villian. I hated when he disregarded Drusilla so easily for Buffy, a woman he had been with for a century vs. a girl he wanted to kill a few years earlier. Come on, are we really supposed to believe that Spike would dump Dru for Buffy at this point? Buffy belonged with Angel and Spike belonged with Dru, simple as that. I don't hate Spuffy but I could never take them seriously. I think Spike getting his soul back ruined season 7, well that and the awful potentials storyline. I think Joss should have had Spike get his chip removed instead of his soul restored after the demon trials. Bring back Dru for season 7 and make them the secondary big bad to Caleb. Perhaps Caleb kills Dru for some reason and this infuriates Spike, who decides to help Buffy a la season 2. One of my favorite episodes was season 3 Lovers Walk, with the hilarious threesome of Angel, Buffy and villian Spike fighting the antagonists while spike incessantly whined over Dru. Imagine that group fighting Caleb and the hellmouth in the series finale. Even without his soul Spike proved he can be a good vampire at times, like when he tried to save Dawn in The Gift (my personal favorite episode of all time) and again when he was the leader of the Scoobies with robot Buffy. Though instead of him closing the hellmouth it would have been hilarious if he high tailed it out of there and left Angel and Buffy to deal with the chaos. Have Willow close the hellmouth to atone for murdering Warren. Spike also would have been better as a villian on the Angel series. Spike and Illyria would have been a great evil pairing. I don't think all this would've made for a compelling storyline, though. Remember - it's not about delivering a satisfying outcome (Spike staying awesomely bad) , but about the journey, and if everyone stayed with whoever fit them the most, there would be no journey. I agree that Spike and Buffy don't make for a great pairing, and also think that Oz and Willow were cute together, and that Drusilla would've been a great villain on every season, but if all of those crowd-pleasers just stayed the same during the entire show's run, then there wouldn't have been a story to tell, no matter how imperfect and "wrong" this story is. ANDand19 wrote: I don't think Buffy "belonged" with either of them. Buffy's relationship with Angel got annoying and intense. IMO, the difference between the relationships was that Spike was able to love Buffy without a soul. The conclusion I made is that the slayer isn't supposed to be tied down by friends and boyfriends, and that's why Buffy couldn't hold on to any of her love interests, and that's what makes her relationship with Xander and Willow so special. I think it's not so much about Buffy being the slayer, than it's about "Buffy" being a long-running show. And as in all long-running shows, it just isn't possible to keep the same love interest for too long, simply because there's so much you can explore in one relationship.
myopics		#357	[-]
Posts: 929 (01/30/10 05:19 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Hey Paparazzi! Glad to see I'm not the only fan of Normal Again, I Only Have Eyes For You and Selfless; and also not the only one who didn't enjoy Something Blue so much. Oaf, I'm guess the 2 episodes I ranked way too high compared to your's are The Killer In Me and Life Serial. Also, the most likely one in my top 10 not to make your top 30 is Selfless, then Normal Again (maaaaybe Prophecy Girl). =( I think the rest are pretty much locks for most people's top 30.
myopics		#358	[-]
Posts: 934 (02/10/10 10:39 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Bump! This should not be on page 4.
myopics		#359	[-]
Posts: 986 (03/16/10 02:29 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Is anyone still up for some Buffy discussion in this thread while we await Oaf's return? I really hope this list gets finished, it was by far my favourite list on this forum!
Oaf		#360	[-]
Posts: 240 (05/23/10 01:58 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	If at first you don't succeed; call it version 1.0 Remove this ad Paparazzi wrote: 129.) 305 Homecoming (I think this is one some might put in the top half, but I really didn't like it) 36.) 618 Entropy (I had trouble with this one, it is probably too high) 31.) 511 Triangle 15.) 713 The Killer in Me These are some unconventional placings, but then again, I have a few unconventional placings of my own down the road... :) I plan on coming back to this list pretty soon. I have a soft spot for this one, and I have every intention of finishing it. Just bear with me.

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