S-22 Edgic (editing and logic) in Survivor Speculation Forum

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S-22 Edgic (editing and logic)

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Mariano Man		#2941	[-]
Posts: 459 (04/05/11 06:10 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	I'd have a photographic memory but it was never developed. Remove this ad greyfox29 wrote: I think the story of the season is Rob as the false god, and Matt as the true god. Rob will eventually kneel before the true god. See how easy it is to create storylines out of thin air. that's actually a great proposal. it is definitely possible that Matt is the true Warrior God and Rob is the false God. I also think it's still possible that both are false Gods and Phillip will be revealed as the true redemptive warrior. That's why my list is - Top Contender - Boston Rob Contenders - Matt, Phillip
Lemun		#2942	[-]
Posts: 513 (04/05/11 07:02 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	People have convinced me that Rob was indeed neutral. The arrogance was more endearing than negative. However, Philip was clearly N this scene. The crispy rice segment was bad for both sides. Natalie and Philip both acted like children, and although you could side with Philip, he still wasn't presented in a positive light in any of his scenes. He is like a Lillian Morris character: OTT character with a lot of CP insight who swings back and forth in tone. Rob: Neutral Phillip: Negative
irJong		#2943	[-]
Posts: 67 (04/05/11 07:04 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Mariano Man wrote: greyfox29 wrote: I think the story of the season is Rob as the false god, and Matt as the true god. Rob will eventually kneel before the true god. See how easy it is to create storylines out of thin air. that's actually a great proposal. it is definitely possible that Matt is the true Warrior God and Rob is the false God. I also think it's still possible that both are false Gods and Phillip will be revealed as the true redemptive warrior. That's why my list is - Top Contender - Boston Rob Contenders - Matt, Phillip I can't speak for greyfox, but I think he was just trying to point out how dumb it is for everyone to keep pulling these bullshit contrived stories out of thin air. For one thing, Matt is definitely not being edited as a "God." If he's being edited in any manner, the emphasis on christianity is about Matt being a loyal follower to the end. Phillip is a retarded winner pick. Phillip might be getting a set-up for ultimately being redeemed (though I'm in the camp that he won't be; just because the theme is redemption overall as far as we can tell, it's dumb to think EVERY negative character will be redeemed), but the fact that the edit has mocked him with the lion roars has Phillip dead in the water as far as winning chances go.
Phoenix1269		#2944	[-]
Posts: 1002 (04/05/11 07:53 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Oowatanite wrote: FYI, Andrea got 14 UTRs and 9 INVs. The INV total included votes from the overseer, both rating watchdogs, and two other veteran watchdogs. I find this particularly interesting.... it's looked like andrea-bias for a little while, but that she did get a "UTR" this week this confirms it to me.
irJong		#2945	[-]
Posts: 72 (04/05/11 08:02 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Phoenix1269 wrote: Oowatanite wrote: FYI, Andrea got 14 UTRs and 9 INVs. The INV total included votes from the overseer, both rating watchdogs, and two other veteran watchdogs. I find this particularly interesting.... it's looked like andrea-bias for a little while, but that she did get a "UTR" this week this confirms it to me. I don't think it's bias for everyone that voted UTR. For my part, I genuinely just don't understand applying the INV rating to her this time. When I think of INV, I think of Kelly Purple and Brett, people that you don't hear from at all.
greyfox29		#2946	[-]
Posts: 9 (04/05/11 08:29 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Edit: fucking yuku. Last Edited By: greyfox29 04/05/11 08:31 PM. Edited 1 times.
greyfox29		#2947	[-]
Posts: 10 (04/05/11 08:31 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	irJong wrote: I can't speak for greyfox, but I think he was just trying to point out how dumb it is for everyone to keep pulling these bullshit contrived stories out of thin air. Pretty much, yeah.
MasterThief		#2948	[-]
Posts: 634 (04/05/11 08:42 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	I gave Andrea UTR because I thought the three girls were on about equal footing this episode with no confessionals and barely any speaking time. Nothing really set any of them apart from each other aside from maybe Natalie being singled out as underage. Andrea and Ashley both spoke in all the same scenes (Crispygate included). As for the bias accusations, I gave her MOR1 last week and felt CP1 was a stretch. And I'm convinced all this contrived "God" story business comes from everyone entertaining Mariano Man's ramblings for too long.
katerade		#2949	[-]
Posts: 127 (04/05/11 08:56 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Mariano Man wrote: greyfox29 wrote: I think the story of the season is Rob as the false god, and Matt as the true god. Rob will eventually kneel before the true god. See how easy it is to create storylines out of thin air. that's actually a great proposal. it is definitely possible that Matt is the true Warrior God and Rob is the false God. I also think it's still possible that both are false Gods and Phillip will be revealed as the true redemptive warrior. That's why my list is - Top Contender - Boston Rob Contenders - Matt, Phillip Its become clear to me that Rob is getting the creepy older gentleman edit.The editors' repeated reminders of Natalie's age and their focus on Natalie and Rob's relationship was the first hint. Its even been brought up that Natalie has intimate knowledge of Rob's underwear and she shares his bed (clearly manipulative unnecessariness). Then we see Rob orchestrating the elimination of all the older people in the tribe, likely trying to lower the average age. The most damning evidence is their editing of Matt to look like a young, innocent blonde girl, or maybe a castrated alter boy. They emphasize the priest/alterboy relationship between them by photoshopping a halo on Matt's head and having him read scripture. There have been several face shots of Rob at RI staring intensely at Matt which were clearly taken from Marquesas, indicating heavy manipulation (this should increase his vis to a 6 btw). Just like the guy who sits behind you on the bus so he can smell your hair, Rob will be kicked off for taking his overbearing-creepy-uncle act too far; the irony is that Philip will be the one who uses his gorilion powers to defend the ladies honour. Last Edited By: katerade 04/05/11 08:58 PM. Edited 1 times.
irJong		#2950	[-]
Posts: 79 (04/05/11 09:04 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	I'd have a photographic memory but it was never developed. Remove this ad katerade wrote: Mariano Man wrote: greyfox29 wrote: I think the story of the season is Rob as the false god, and Matt as the true god. Rob will eventually kneel before the true god. See how easy it is to create storylines out of thin air. that's actually a great proposal. it is definitely possible that Matt is the true Warrior God and Rob is the false God. I also think it's still possible that both are false Gods and Phillip will be revealed as the true redemptive warrior. That's why my list is - Top Contender - Boston Rob Contenders - Matt, Phillip Its become clear to me that Rob is getting the creepy older gentleman edit.The editors' repeated reminders of Natalie's age and their focus on Natalie and Rob's relationship was the first hint. Its even been brought up that Natalie has intimate knowledge of Rob's underwear and she shares his bed (clearly manipulative unnecessariness). Then we see Rob orchestrating the elimination of all the older people in the tribe, likely trying to lower the average age. The most damning evidence is their editing of Matt to look like a young, innocent blonde girl, or maybe a castrated alter boy. They emphasize the priest/alterboy relationship between them by photoshopping a halo on Matt's head and having him read scripture. There have been several face shots of Rob at RI staring intensely at Matt which were clearly taken from Marquesas, indicating heavy manipulation (this should increase his vis to a 6 btw). Just like the guy who sits behind you on the bus so he can smell your hair, Rob will be kicked off for taking his overbearing-creepy-uncle act too far; the irony is that Philip will be the one who uses his gorilion powers to defend the ladies honour. I love you.
greyfox29		#2951	[-]
Posts: 12 (04/05/11 09:05 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	getting real wrote: I was talking about Matt & Rob being the only two characters the editing has intended for us to care about This is true, and it's very sad that out of the entire cast, only 3 contestants are getting any screentime - Rob, Matt and Phillip. Terrible editing this season.
et91		#2952	[-]
Posts: 677 (04/05/11 09:18 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	irJong wrote: Phoenix1269 wrote: Oowatanite wrote: FYI, Andrea got 14 UTRs and 9 INVs. The INV total included votes from the overseer, both rating watchdogs, and two other veteran watchdogs. I find this particularly interesting.... it's looked like andrea-bias for a little while, but that she did get a "UTR" this week this confirms it to me. I don't think it's bias for everyone that voted UTR. For my part, I genuinely just don't understand applying the INV rating to her this time. When I think of INV, I think of Kelly Purple and Brett, people that you don't hear from at all. That. INV is given out far too liberally
Mariano Man		#2953	[-]
Posts: 464 (04/05/11 09:32 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	greyfox29 wrote: getting real wrote: I was talking about Matt & Rob being the only two characters the editing has intended for us to care about This is true, and it's very sad that out of the entire cast, only 3 contestants are getting any screentime - Rob, Matt and Phillip. Terrible editing this season. Rob - An established Star who delivers entertainment gold every time he's on a season Matt - Will be rewarded post merge with a HUGE edit as a thank you for making the season theme a complete success Phillip - Arguably the Greatest Breakout character this show has ever seen. Coach 2.0 Don't expect things to change any time soon. Especially if one of them is the winner, which I believe is the case.
irJong		#2954	[-]
Posts: 81 (04/05/11 09:40 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Mariano Man wrote: Phillip - Arguably the Greatest Breakout character this show has ever seen. Coach 2.0 Did you watch Samoa?
fat little fingers		#2955	[-]
Posts: 6706 (04/05/11 09:47 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	gr: Yes, of course, but using religion as a catalyst for conflict is not always consistent with the premise that they 'treat religion with respect'. But, are they using religion as a catalyst for conflict? So far, the Rob=God stuff seems to be coming from posters, not the show. Matt's religious comments have been personal and has never included other players. He has simply stated that his religion is everything for him and he sees his life as guided by Providence. He as never spoken of the game conflicts in religious terms. I agree that there was meant to be a reminder of Matt, when Rob failed to recognize the statue of Christ. But, I'm not ready to jump to referencing the show as a Christian allegory just yet. It may be, but I need to see more before naming Rob this and Matt that, etc.
jonnyfairplay		#2956	[-]
Posts: 273 (04/05/11 10:29 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	The problem with a lot of spec posters is that they are overeager to see patterns that really aren't there... like this whole Rob as false God business, or ZOMG GUYS!, this season natalie = tree frog coach = spider phillip = lizard, rodger = father, elizabeth = daughter, phillip = court jester The editors don't think about shit like that. Mostly all that they try to do is pick carefully among the footage to include enough material to both adequately explain the plot and provide entertaining enough scenes so people keep watching. They are selective on a secondary level in that they try to make the winner seem deserving; the antagonists more evil; the entertainingly crazy characters more one-dimensional - pimping the characters in the way that they believe they need to be pimped for the show to be enjoyable. People overthink the symbolism way too much; I seriously doubt the editors think in symbols very often, if at all.
greyfox29		#2957	[-]
Posts: 15 (04/05/11 10:38 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Instead of focusing on symbolism that could mean anything, people should be focusing on that manipulated conversation between Phillip and Andrea. I believe it is the most important piece of footage in the season to date. I remember last season Fabio got a similarly spliced together confessional in the first episode that was his million-dollar quote.
irJong		#2958	[-]
Posts: 83 (04/05/11 10:43 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	jonnyfairplay wrote: The problem with a lot of spec posters is that they are overeager to see patterns that really aren't there... like this whole Rob as false God business, or ZOMG GUYS!, this season natalie = tree frog coach = spider phillip = lizard, rodger = father, elizabeth = daughter, phillip = court jester The editors don't think about shit like that. Mostly all that they try to do is pick carefully among the footage to include enough material to both adequately explain the plot and provide entertaining enough scenes so people keep watching. They are selective on a secondary level in that they try to make the winner seem deserving; the antagonists more evil; the entertainingly crazy characters more one-dimensional - pimping the characters in the way that they believe they need to be pimped for the show to be enjoyable. People overthink the symbolism way too much; I seriously doubt the editors think in symbols very often, if at all. I agree that a lot of sucksters are overeager about identifying patterns, but I wouldn't say that the editors aren't deliberate with some of the more overt symbols. For example, the use of snake or spider footage as a lead-up to a scene setting up a blindside/betrayal or a player scrambling is probably deliberate. I wouldn't say they are quite so calculated with the much more subtle thematic issues such as RI being presented as a biblical allegory.
dotsdfe		#2959	[-]
Posts: 483 (04/05/11 10:51 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts	Yeah, some of the symbols that people are spotting are a bit ridiculous. The main focus on the editing is to tell stories, but keep them simple enough for the casual viewer to figure it out. The casual viewer isn't going to get a group of friends together to analyze who the frog might represent. However, there are subtle foreshadowing things that the casual isn't going to be as aware of, but might notice, such as Rob's "Just missed it"/"I was going for the win" scene. A casual might pick up on it and equate it to the game, or would probably catch it on a rewatch, but it wouldn't require deep analysis to figure out.
Phoenix1269		#2960	[-]
Posts: 1003 (04/05/11 10:57 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts	I'd have a photographic memory but it was never developed. Remove this ad TONE WATCHDOG STUFF This is gonna be quick & dirty - i have been / am currently in the midst of teaching an intensive course and still having to do my regular work, so i don't have a lot of tie right at this moment... but... here it is... Rob I originally voted N for Rob. I always felt though, the N was slight, and not even a bad N...it was more like the "roguish" N that getting real was talking about. I thought he was kinda cheeky this episode, maybe a bit arrogant. I was concerned about the odd semi-contradictory confessional that he had about Philip, EVEN THOUGH Philip is pretty much unaware most of the time, he does show some odd moments of clarity.... It was an odd episode for Rob in some ways. RedCoffee even pointed out that for people who really like rob they will find his antics hilarious, for those who really dislike rob, they will find him cocky and annoying. Now for me personally, Rob makes me laugh, I also find Philip to be absolutely hillarious, but then i thought Coach was a scream too.... what can i say, i have the sense of humour of a 12 year! I try very hard to keep my off-beat sense of humour in check when i do tone, and as a result, when i rewatched, there were a few instances where i felt that Rob seemed pretty cocky (the whole idol/clue business, babysitting Philip, i'll front side him) but even still, it wasn't overt. I asked myself is the N-tone really strong? No, it's not. Does he come across a "bad" (like Philip?). No. Is Neutral a better fit? probably. At the end of the day, i feel like in some ways, this is an episode where people get to decide for themselves how Rob was, but ultimately he wasn't edited overly N. And at any rate it doesn't hurt him. ROB = NEUTRAL Phillip I originally voted M for Phil, not because i saw a whole whack of P in his edit, but more because i thought that Phil had a couple o astute observations, and some valid points for his poor me attitude and that the editors were leaving it up to the audience to decide. However, upon rewatching, the valid points were really not that valid... and Phil was on a serious Rob-bash for the first part of the episode. So much of his edit was strictly OTT (all the samuri stuff, and bumbling fool antics) and what wasn't was N. "Entitled" is always N in my mind. I slapped Ashley and Natalie with N's becuase of their entitled-ness a couple of eps back, Phil should get the same treatment. He feels he is entitled due to his age. A lot of bravado, a lot of whining, a lot of poor me....but nothing to show that he is doing or trying to do anything about it. He is over the top negative. It was hammered into our heads this time. He doesn't fit in, he's mostly clueless, he's a bumbling stumbling buffoon who can't keep his mouth shut...i'd even say there were glimmers of jealousy there. He was definitiely more N than i originally gave him credit for. Phillip = Negative

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S-22 Edgic (editing and logic)