Episode 9 Spoilers in Survivor Spoilers Forum

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Episode 9 Spoilers

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monicajamiemoore		#121	[-]
Posts: 65 (11/06/11 12:05 PM) More Recent Posts	When I was born I was so surprised I didn�t talk for a year and a half. Remove this ad Windmill Bill wrote: EC101 wrote: SolitaryPhoenix wrote: If they treated Cochran so well, why was Dawn moved to tears that she hadn't stood up for him? We may not have seen all the bullying, but it certainly seems that it happened. As we've seen, bullying can lead to tragic results in children; why would an adult not feel the need to give it back when given the opportunity? I think Ozzy, Whitney, Keith, and Jim screwed themselves by their own actions, be it the way they chose to vote or the way they apparently treated Cochran, like a lesser member of the tribe, a place-maker they found expendable at their convenience. Cochran was not bullied, c'mon, that's a bunch of BS. He was probably talked down to by Keith, but bullied? What did they bully the idiot about? Did they shove him around and steal his coconuts? Can any one of you imagine getting on this season and boom, right when the merge happens you start to believe Coach is genuine and all his blabber is for real? Cochran is a moron of a Survivor fan. As for Dawn moved to tears - she was one of the people that was all gung-ho about sending his ass to Redemption Island so he could take responsibility for his stupidity in the challenge...she did some of the so-called 'bullying'. Anyone crying a river for the bullying of Cochran is just about as stupid as he is. Now if Cochran gets beat-up after this tribal council, then I might feel bad for him for a nano-second, otherwise please with the bully crap, it's utter nonsense. Yes, Cochran was bullied. Pretty severely. That's about all I can post since I'm not one to post spoilers, but let's not be naive and think the show was edited to show every -- or even the worst -- of what Cochran got, since it might not necessarily fit their story arc for him. Well since Cochran story arch is "woe is me" then the above would have fit just perfectly with such an arch. So I don't buy it.
JT4ever		#122	[-]
Posts: 716 (11/06/11 12:07 PM) More Recent Posts	SwineForkbeard wrote: It is apparent from the insider videos that the Upolus approached him for an endgame deal So what exactly was Upolu's F4 promise worth considering that: 1 - Upolu had the end game to win and nothing to do lose by making that promise. 2 - If Upolu go back on their word, they only have the roach's vote to lose. 3 - The roach can't expect to get any leverage from threatening to tell the world about the promise because a) the other 3 Upolu members will believe it was a perfectly acceptable ploy to get the roach to flip, and b) the Savaii members will just laugh and say, "Oh you poor baby." So I'm thinking that anyone with half a brain would have realized how utterly worthless that agreement was. Meanwhile, what had Savaii already shown to the roach: 1 - That they were willing to vote out bigger threats ahead of him. 2 - That they were willing to work with him to oust said bigger threats. 3 - That one of them trusted him enough to give him his valuable HII when there was no way anyone could force the roach to give the idol back. So I'm thinking that if the roach factored respective "promises" into his decision, he's even stupider than I think. At the end of the day, the roach didn't want to face the PROD. Everything else is rationalization.
Pyre		#123	[-]
Posts: 1755 (11/06/11 12:07 PM) More Recent Posts	Exactly. The only reason they'd have not to show it would be if one of the "bullies" won, which looks impossible at this point.
EC101		#124	[-]
Posts: 42 (11/06/11 12:08 PM) More Recent Posts	SwineForkbeard wrote: Whether Cochran was bullied or not is completely subjective and depends on who you ask. It is apparent from the insider videos that the Upolus approached him for an endgame deal while Savaii did not. So suffice it to say that, bullying or no bullying, it's entirely their fault that they expected Cochran to stick his neck out for them but didn't bother to convince him that he had much to gain if it paid off. I can totally agree with that - the Savaii's were not very smart about making him feel included. With a person like Cochran they needed to feed his ego and they didn't. They needed to make deals and lie to him and they didn't. It was their mistake for keeping him in the first place and their second mistake in not feeding him the crap he was looking for. They lived with him for 3 weeks and they should have known that he was a baby by that point and that they had to feed the baby to keep him loyal. I still can't disrespect them for being honest with them - not a good Survivor strategy, but not a bad way to be in life I'd say.
Windmill Bill		#125	[-]
Posts: 22 (11/06/11 12:43 PM) More Recent Posts	JT4ever wrote: Windmill Bill wrote: Yes, Cochran was bullied. Pretty severely. That's about all I can post since I'm not one to post spoilers Thanks for the completely unsubstantiated character assassination. Next. Apparently, you don't have an iota of an idea of what character assassination means.
SwineForkbeard		#126	[-]
Posts: 3414 (11/06/11 12:44 PM) Registered user More Recent Posts	JT4ever wrote: SwineForkbeard wrote: It is apparent from the insider videos that the Upolus approached him for an endgame deal So what exactly was Upolu's F4 promise worth considering that: 1 - Upolu had the end game to win and nothing to do lose by making that promise. 2 - If Upolu go back on their word, they only have the roach's vote to lose. 3 - The roach can't expect to get any leverage from threatening to tell the world about the promise because a) the other 3 Upolu members will believe it was a perfectly acceptable ploy to get the roach to flip, and b) the Savaii members will just laugh and say, "Oh you poor baby." So I'm thinking that anyone with half a brain would have realized how utterly worthless that agreement was. Meanwhile, what had Savaii already shown to the roach: 1 - That they were willing to vote out bigger threats ahead of him. 2 - That they were willing to work with him to oust said bigger threats. 3 - That one of them trusted him enough to give him his valuable HII when there was no way anyone could force the roach to give the idol back. So I'm thinking that if the roach factored respective "promises" into his decision, he's even stupider than I think. At the end of the day, the roach didn't want to face the PROD. Everything else is rationalization. What "bigger threats" are you talking about, Elyse? That wasn't voting out a threat, that was a power play by Jim to weaken Ozzy so he could be the one calling the shots. Did anybody ever talk to Cochran about voting out actual threats like Keith or Ozzy, that we know of? Jim also said he wanted to keep Ozzy around after the merge because he's a bigger target, so there was no guarantee that Cochran could just sit back and let them drag him to end as a goat. So I find your analysis unconvincing, since if Cochran hasn't had any explicit promises from his tribemates, all he has are assumptions. Assumptions that his tribemates will all be rational and predictable and blind faith that an Upolu will pick the rock. Hardly a golden ticket to the final 3. If I were to assume anything, it would be that if my tribemates aren't discussing the endgame with me, it means that I'm not in their endgame plans.
Windmill Bill		#127	[-]
Posts: 23 (11/06/11 12:48 PM) More Recent Posts	monicajamiemoore wrote: Windmill Bill wrote: EC101 wrote: Cochran was not bullied, c'mon, that's a bunch of BS. He was probably talked down to by Keith, but bullied? What did they bully the idiot about? Did they shove him around and steal his coconuts? Can any one of you imagine getting on this season and boom, right when the merge happens you start to believe Coach is genuine and all his blabber is for real? Cochran is a moron of a Survivor fan. As for Dawn moved to tears - she was one of the people that was all gung-ho about sending his ass to Redemption Island so he could take responsibility for his stupidity in the challenge...she did some of the so-called 'bullying'. Anyone crying a river for the bullying of Cochran is just about as stupid as he is. Now if Cochran gets beat-up after this tribal council, then I might feel bad for him for a nano-second, otherwise please with the bully crap, it's utter nonsense. Yes, Cochran was bullied. Pretty severely. That's about all I can post since I'm not one to post spoilers, but let's not be naive and think the show was edited to show every -- or even the worst -- of what Cochran got, since it might not necessarily fit their story arc for him. Well since Cochran story arch is "woe is me" then the above would have fit just perfectly with such an arch. So I don't buy it. I actually agree with you completely. I don't understand why the stuff wasn't included in the edit. The below probably violates some rule but whatever... I can think of 3 possibilities why it wasn't included. 1. One of the bullies wins 2. It was so malicious or unnecessary or just mean that absolutely no one would be rooting for Savaii. 3. They wanted to set up this past episode, and if they had shown all of how Cochran had been treated, rather than just bits and pieces, it would have been obvious what he'd do at this point. My gut tells my option 3. That being said, Dawn's pre-immunity confessionals were probably more in line with what actually happened on Savaii.
ShowStealer		#128	[-]
Posts: 128 (11/06/11 01:04 PM) More Recent Posts	what happend to the double boot
PrettyGoodYear1988		#129	[-]
Posts: 5309 (11/06/11 01:15 PM) Registered user More Recent Posts	^ What do you mean? We're having one. Ozzy and then Jim are voted out.
ShowStealer		#130	[-]
Posts: 129 (11/06/11 01:22 PM) More Recent Posts	When I was born I was so surprised I didn�t talk for a year and a half. Remove this ad ^ i definitely missed the other spoiler thanks thats mean its either coach goes next or his going to the end
cindidindi76		#131	[-]
Posts: 28163 (11/06/11 01:24 PM) Registered User More Recent Posts	wtf?
JT4ever		#132	[-]
Posts: 717 (11/06/11 02:45 PM) More Recent Posts	SwineForkbeard wrote: What "bigger threats" are you talking about, Elyse? That wasn't voting out a threat, that was a power play by Jim to weaken Ozzy so he could be the one calling the shots. Come now. Jim is many things, but nothing of what we've seen of him makes him out to be someone who would make a move he didn't genuinely think would improve his chances of winning. He made it pretty clear that the wanted to break up the tight pair that was Ozzy an Elyse. The pair was the threat. Just as the pair of Keith and Whitney represented a threat he would have wanted to go after before worrying about the roach. Jim also said he wanted to keep Ozzy around after the merge because he's a bigger target That's a blatant misrepresentation of what Jim said. He said he wanted to keep Ozzy around during the pre-merge because Ozzy would help win team challenges. And that Ozzy would be a bigger target after the merge. Jim is many things, but he's not an idiot player who would want to keep around in the post-merge an immunity monster who had previously made it to FTC. So I find your analysis unconvincing, since if Cochran hasn't had any explicit promises from his tribemates, all he has are assumptions. Assumptions that his tribemates will all be rational and predictable "Promises" are worth less to a serious player than "assumptions" that people will predictably behave in ways that benefit their own interests. If someone doesn't understand that, then they don't really understand Survivor. and blind faith that an Upolu will pick the rock. Not blind faith, a 5 out of 7 chance. If I were to assume anything, it would be that if my tribemates aren't discussing the endgame with me, it means that I'm not in their endgame plans. It's not as if Savaii weren't a little busy just then with the business of surviving the merge intact. We didn't exactly see Upolu going around making end game deals with each other either. They were far too busy making false promises to the roach. In any case, the idea is for you to show your tribe mates how you can help them get further in the game, not for you to wait for them to show you how they can help you get further.
SwineForkbeard		#133	[-]
Posts: 3415 (11/06/11 03:00 PM) Registered user More Recent Posts	Savaii couldn't be bothered to keep their weak link on the reservation because they were "too busy?" Are you that loath to concede that the fault doesn't lie with Cochran alone that you'll make such a ludicrous excuse for them? They telegraphed their own contempt for Cochran in conscripting him to play the part of the villainous outcast who idoled Ozzy out of the game, because they probably figured that was the most plausible role for him. They only guaranteed that he would be the one that Upolu would try to entice to flip and make the promises that they were "too busy" to make in the first place. There's plenty of blame to go around for what Cochran did, if you're that emotionally invested and butthurt over it that blame is necessary.
SwineForkbeard		#134	[-]
Posts: 3416 (11/06/11 03:08 PM) Registered user More Recent Posts	JT4ever wrote: We didn't exactly see Upolu going around making end game deals with each other either. Very astute point. If we didn't see it, it couldn't have happened. Kind of like those bogus bullying rumors Cochran made up.
JT4ever		#135	[-]
Posts: 719 (11/06/11 03:09 PM) More Recent Posts	SwineForkbeard wrote: Savaii couldn't be bothered to keep their weak link on the reservation because they were "too busy?" Are you that loath to concede that the fault doesn't lie with Cochran alone that you'll make such a ludicrous excuse for them? Savaii clearly fucked up by underestimating the sheer amount of babying it would take to keep a craven from wetting his pants himself.
perrocaliente		#136	[-]
Posts: 2828 (11/06/11 03:12 PM) Registered user More Recent Posts	Here's a question. Who the fuck is cochran that people have to come up to him to make an alliance? Last I checked, Cochran was supposed to have the social game to take him far. Where is this social game? say that cock only turned on savii cuz they were bullying him is beyond ludicrous edited to remove violation of Rule #8 Last Edited By: Antithesys 11/06/11 07:48 PM. Edited 1 times.
JT4ever		#137	[-]
Posts: 720 (11/06/11 03:14 PM) More Recent Posts	SwineForkbeard wrote: If we didn't see it, it couldn't have happened. Kind of like those bogus bullying rumors Cochran made up. Anything could have happened, and anyone can represent anything that happened however they perceived it. And?
mds1978ca		#138	[-]
Posts: 826 (11/06/11 03:24 PM) More Recent Posts	I would not want to be on a tribe that tells me repeatedly that they decided not to vote me out at TC as though they were doing me a favor and I should somehow feel gratitude for their selfless acts of generosity and kowtow to their every demand because I somehow owe it to them. That's like Ike Turner beating the crap out of Tina and then acting like he deserves her respect and gratitude because he paid the rent this month and bought her a new dress, and then calling Tina a coward for finally deciding to fight back and stand up for herself. I wouldn't go so far as to say Cochrane is being bullied by his tribe, but I would call this an abusive relationship. Cochrane was being abused by his tribe, and the footage doesn't lie, so you can't deny it. I'm just surprised that so many of you see this and blame the victim, calling him a cockroach or a rat because he didn't stand by his abusive family and take their shit anymore.
SurvILA		#139	[-]
Posts: 446 (11/06/11 03:25 PM) Registered User More Recent Posts	Kirblar wrote: the sole surviva wrote: savaii brought this upon themselves when they treated cochran like shit Saving someone 4 times at Tribal Council is treating someone like shit? That's why Savaii is doomed to fail. Treating him like shit yet not voting him out. What do they expect? They sent him to chopping block at every TC without finishing the execution. He's bound to flip at merge, it's written on the wall. But none of them (Jim or Ozzy) took the time to made him a good endgame deal, not even a fake one. You take high risk if you believe you'll get high return. Savaii foolishly expected him to be loyal to them, they reap what they sow.
survivorgirl22		#140	[-]
Posts: 3318 (11/06/11 04:09 PM) More Recent Posts	When I was born I was so surprised I didn�t talk for a year and a half. Remove this ad I think either way we were going to have a pagonging.It was just a matter of which tribe.Had Ozzys plan worked it would have been the other way around.Only thing is If Savai'i were the majority I think we would have the potential for Ozzy being blindsided by Jim,Dawn,Cochran later on.I don't think there's as much potential for an intertribal shake up on Upolu.I also think Jim getting rid of Elyse is a move you make post-merge once a few Upolus are gone not so early.It would be different if Jim had turned completely against Ozzy afterwards but he didn't so keeping Elyse for the time being was the best move IMO. edited to remove violation of Rule #8 Last Edited By: Antithesys 11/06/11 07:50 PM. Edited 1 times.

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Episode 9 Spoilers