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 DouglassGirl |
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Posts: 642 (07/25/09 11:07 AM) Registered user |
puckparent wrote: I have Dish Satellite and HDNet ran all 2 years in order. So I was able to see them there. Something to check out, if you get that channel as well. Meanwhile, I'm think Netflix is your best bet. And yeah, they're really good. |
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 cginspace |
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Posts: 8732 (07/25/09 1:15 PM) Registered user |
I actually like when main characters die. One of my issues with most American stuff (action AND sci-fi) is that there are two people fighting 5,000, and
somehow the two both survive while most of the 5,000 die. It makes it much more heart-wrenching, and makes me invest more in the series because it hews closer
(if still not exactly) to real life.
I was really bummed that Ianto died; but it helped the story. It took Harkness to a different place, and actually made his question how he views his relationships (particularly since it was implied that most of his lovers had died of old age, or after many years together with Jack staying young and the other growing old). I think US television could learn a lesson, there. Keep it about the story and the themes, not about likeable characters or refusal to challenge your audience. |
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Gregoire |
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Posts: 33791 (07/25/09 9:12 PM) Registered user |
'Day 4' *crying*. What I'm enjoying about this mini-series is that it feels like a really classic sci-fi scenario, like something Ray Bradbury
might have cooked up. And, with a few cheesy and occasional unbelievable exceptions, it's playing out in a very provokative, dramatic way. I actually like
that Ianto's death was only a side tragedy to the main event. Even the stupid Lois Abiba stuff actually turned out okay once she spoke out. I officially
love Gwen too. It only took 3 seasons! <3
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fffingybyach |
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Posts: 1120 (07/25/09 10:21 PM) |
Just watched epi 5. That was fffing depressing. Well done, but depressing nevertheless.
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Gregoire |
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Posts: 33793 (07/25/09 10:25 PM) Registered user |
I hope you Torchwood fans watch MI:5 (also called Spooks in the UK) because that's where they get this killing-off-main-characters trend.
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James Barber |
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Posts: 15711 (07/26/09 12:42 AM) Registered User |
cginspace wrote:Ianto's death did the opposite with me. The circumstances were so absurd (basically making Ianto and Jack into complete fools to justify them going there in the first place) that I could not see any realism in it. I practically saw strings at that point. Jack's reaction was so cold, and Ianto's death was so immediately overshadowed, I thought it ended up being a textbook example of a stunt death. At least when Tosh and Owen were killed, their deaths were about them, and were written true to their characters. The story seemed to be written for viewers who had never seen Torchwood before and wouldn't give a fig about Ianto in the first place. Ianto was a funny, quirky guy on the show, one who happened to be involved with Jack. In Children of Earth, he was just Jack's appendage, killed off only because it was supposed to create more turmoil for Jack. The character himself no longer had any meaning. I thought it was telling, not showing, because even though I liked Ianto and Jack together I have never believed he cared so much about Ianto that he would be broken by his death. Jack has seen lovers die at a young age. He saw the real Jack Harkness go off to die. I also didn't think Jack's behavior was anything new. This was simply a darker version of the same woe-is-me character which has been presented for several years now.He's let children die before, or basically die. I know this was supposed to be different, but since we had never seen this grandson before now, or even heard him mentioned, I didn't feel the emotions. I think a much gutsier writing choice would have been Jack killing his grandson and then losing Ianto for good, Ianto then dying or Ianto leaving, because that would have shown more of a dimension on Jack's actions than this latest version of the mopey wanderer. I think this type of material only works if the lead actor can act the hell out of it, and John Barrowman...is he a capable actor, charismatic, dashing? Yes. A good dramatic actor? I don't think he is. I thought he was very off in Ianto's death scene. I kept hoping for something, because the writing wasn't giving it (he refused to comfort Ianto or even say he loved him). I think when you kill characters off only to kill them off, and have to tack on a reaction in a way which you don't manage to fully sell, then they lose their meaning. It's a shame, because I thought the material which had nothing to do with Jack was quite good. If they ever do bring Torchwood back they should do it without him.
Last Edited By: James Barber
07/26/09 1:17 AM.
Edited 3 times.
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SurvivorArctic |
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Posts: 19533 (07/26/09 1:27 AM) Not a team player
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Jack is Torchwood at this point, so briinging back the series/mini-series without him wouldn't feel right and I doubt it would be watched by the same
numbers.
I love Gwen but I adore Jack, so Torchwood without either or both of them just wouldn't be worth it to me. |
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James Barber |
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Posts: 15712 (07/26/09 1:48 AM) Registered User |
SurvivorArctic wrote:I liked the flirty, dashing Jack, who had a trace of melancholy. That's what Barrowman excels at. Even when they made Jack a little darker, he was OK, but the miniseries took this to the point of self-parody. This emo no-hoper who causes carnage everywhere he goes. I don't know how Jack can go back from this. I think they could still carry on Torchwood with just Gwen, Rhys (until they kill him off too, as yet another feint at realism), maybe that woman who blackmailed the PM into resigning. The Torchwood I knew was destroyed in the season two finale and this miniseries. I think it's dead forever and if they carry on I wish they would just move on entirely. I know a lot of people will probably only want to see Torchwood with Jack, and I can see why, but when I was watching this and the story went on I realized how much better I liked most of the stuff without him. Torchwood was originally conceived as a show without Jack, and he was put in later on, and I felt like this miniseries RTD was much more comfortable with those other elements (and Gwen, since he loves Gwen) than he ever was with Jack or Ianto. Steven Moffat seemed to write for a fun yet complex Jack in his debut episodes. Maybe Jack could appear in some episodes with Matt Smith's Doctor. |
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fffingybyach |
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Posts: 1121 (07/26/09 6:59 AM) |
http://www.comicmix.com/news/2009/07/25/exclusive-torchwood-picked-up-for-another-season-by-bbc/
EXCLUSIVE: Torchwood picked up for another season by BBC
UPDATE: BBC America told ComicMix's Mike Raub that Torchwood has been picked up for a fourth season. No word on when it will air or the number of episodes. This follows the highly succesful UK broadcast of Children Of Earth. |
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JRobbed |
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Posts: 10416 (07/26/09 7:29 AM) Registered User |
No surprise, the numbers for the miniseries were fantastic.
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PinotEnvy |
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Posts: 2041 (07/27/09 6:16 AM) Registered user |
Gregoire wrote: This. I marathoned the four eps, plus extras over the weekend and was too tired to finish ep 5 last night, so I will watch it tonight. Sad to see Ianto die, but it was an amazing scene and I can accept it as he died a hero and it works to progress the story & Jack's character. This mini series event is amazing and leads to so many debates about what value life has to people and where different people rationalize drawing lines. Very deep and, sadly, very plausible. I can understand that they thought killing Jack and the others to keep the secret that they already gave in to the alien terrorists before in the past, but you'd think they would have thought it out more and realized it would still somehow get out and killing Jack, their alien expert, was a really dumb idea. Can't wait to see "Day 5" tonight, especially reading through this thread. However, I must say that the thought that this may be the series finale depresses me. I just love this show so much . . . and Capt. Jack Harkness, of course. |
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PinotEnvy |
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Posts: 2042 (07/27/09 6:20 AM) Registered user |
Finished reading this last page and *celebration* for Torchwood being renewed.
And, JB, as SA said, Capt. Jack IS Torchwood and the series cannot go on without him. |
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James Barber |
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Posts: 15819 (07/27/09 7:19 AM) Registered User |
The old Torchwood couldn't have gone on, but when everything that made Torchwood what it was is gone (including most of what we knew of Jack's
character), what is left? They're going to have to totally rebuild everything anyway, and now they will have to try to figure out what to do with a
character who helped cause the death of his boyfriend and then killed his grandson. If they're going to just have more angst, I don't know if John
Barrowman is suited, and I don't know how they can top this level of pain. If they're going to go back to lightheartedness, then all of the deaths will
seem even less meaningful.
There's been plenty of talk about whether or not Ianto should have been killed but this article is one which was similar to how I felt -- him being killed didn't bother me so much as his death being so dumb and ultimately pointless. I'm glad Torchwood will go on but unless they make a lot of changes to their lineup and to their plotting and characterization than I'm not sure what they can do. |
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tarzan groupie |
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Posts: 9133 (07/27/09 10:23 AM) Registered user |
I stumbled upon Day 1 and Day 2 on "On Demand" saturday, and was thrilled to see they were running the whole series on Sunday, as it was killing me
that the other days weren't On Demand yet.
Being a newbie to this series, Jack was not a favorite of mine. The acting when his lover died was goofy. And I'm sure there's a story behind the trench coat, but it made him look like Michael Jackson. Plus, has anyone mentioned his a Mark Steines (from Entertainment Tonite) clone? Other than that, I thought it was great. The scenes where the military were grabbing the kids made my heart break in two. It was devastating. I definitely want to get the other seasons on DVD, to learn more about the characters. |
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1blond |
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Posts: 2230 (07/27/09 1:41 PM) Registered user |
We're HUGE Torchwood fans, and looked forward to the mini-series.
( never liked the Ianto/Jack relationship. Liked it better when Jack flirted with Gwen and Ianto and was more ambiguously gay. I read that John B called his character, "omni-sexual." I liked that better.) Anyway...... I liked the mini-series right up to epi 5. By the end, I felt like I'd wasted a week. It all just seemed too ridiculous, even for Torchwood. And I was holding out hope that whatever it was that had happened to Jack to cause his immortality ( which was never explained, in the series ), might have been a hereditary thing, so his grandson could've lived. I was also distracted by Jack's daughter's smirks. It bugged the hell out of me. The actress had been in another British series called, Meadowlands, and was quite good in it. The things I LIKED about the mini series were Gwen and Rhys. For the first time, I FINALLY witnessed some chemistry, there. Loved that he could be involved with Torchwood, finally. Loved Lois Habiba! Those contact lenses were a hoot. Also liked Ianto's sister. |
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Gregoire |
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Posts: 33803 (07/27/09 1:50 PM) Registered user |
I would like to see a Torchwood spinoff called HI I'M LOIS HABIBA about a hapless temp who goes from job to job and gets involved with
massive top-secret, international and occasional intergalactic situations which she then helps solve.
HABIBA: She saves the world and makes coffee too 
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tarzan groupie |
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Posts: 9135 (07/27/09 1:53 PM) Registered user |
hehe. Yeah, it cracked me up how she went from "first day on the job" to conferencing with the Prime Minister and the head of the UN. That, like,
happens to me ALL THE TIME!
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PinotEnvy |
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Posts: 2043 (07/27/09 2:09 PM) Registered user |
1blond wrote:A couple of responses. Do you watch Dr. Who? That is where Jack's story essentially begins for viewers and his immortality was caused by an event that occurred at the end of Season 1 where he was brought back to life by Rose and The Doctor then abandoned Jack. Jack did not know how he ended up becomming immortal and why The Doctor abandoned him. Later there were cross-overs where Jack left his Torchwood gang to catch up with The Doctor to find out what happened. During this 5 day miniseries it was also touched upon. Jack explained that because he is firmly attached to a certain event in time and space he can never die. Jack's omnisexuality is also explained in bits and pieces during his appearances on Dr. Who and Torchwood. He basically doesn't discriminate and loves men & women, alien & human alike and he has this very "magnetic" personality and most people who come in contact with him easily fall for his charms. I actually love that Capt. Jack (John Barrowman) has great chemistry with both men and women that he comes into contact with. I thought it was very telling when Ianto explained to his sister that it wasn't "men" he was attracted to, it was Jack in particular. I love Jack flirting with everybody and being an all-around man whore. He makes the women silly and has obvious chemistry with the ladies, but then you see someone like Ianto fall for him after a couple of seasons of flirtation and I thought it was great the way it played out. And that snogging/fight last season between Capt. Jack & Capt. John (James Marsters) HOT HOT HOT. |
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superkyle |
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Posts: 922 (07/27/09 3:26 PM) |
Gregoire wrote: Hopefully in the end she doesn't forget it all after her memory is completely wiped so that she doesn't burn up. But I loved Lois Habiba, and I hope she and Bridget both join the Torchwood team in season 4. |
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James Barber |
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Posts: 15820 (07/27/09 5:04 PM) Registered User |
I wish they'd done more to build up a relationship between Jack and Ianto. I usually just saw them as friends with benefits, with Jack in particular
keeping distant. That's why I didn't buy that Ianto's death caused Jack to go dark. If Jack stupidly getting Ianto killed had done it, yeah, but
they didn't address that in a major way. I can't imagine what Jack must be like to the fans who never saw him on Who, or even on early TW. The Jack who
was in the miniseries must be very difficult to take.
Lois was OK but she was a bit Mary Sue. I'm not sure how two Mary Sues (Gwen and Lois) would work. What about that older woman who blackmailed the PM into resigning? Her, Gwen, and Lois, and some guy. I hope they will bring Captain John back at some point, as long as they don't kill him off. |
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This just in: a rep from BBCAmerica has let it out to our man on the scene that
Torchwood has been picked up for another season by the BBC. Details to come...
